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Originally Posted by Igzy
Psychology isn't just about "psychologists." It is the whole study of human behavior and how people learn and improve. Lee basically threw all that out and said we need to just soak in the Spirit to get transformed. My assertion is that is an inefficient way to grow. We need to also use all the psychological tools God has given us to learn, change and improve. Transformation, the Bible says, is a matter of "the renewing of our mind." That implies our thinking changes
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I haven't been to psychiatrists or psychologists ever before. So, I do not know the exact difference and honestly, I don't care. What I meant was 'There have been saints in my local church who have been allowed to treat issues with their psyche'.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Igzy
We need grace, but we also need to determine to do certain things, particularly we need to decide to think in new ways. That's what repenting means. I had to make a definite effort to overcome certain sins. Just waiting for the Spirit to change oneself is not good enough, in my experience.
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I do not believe that I can do anything by myself.
For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing. (Rom 7:18)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Igzy
Be honest, has the practice of "just taking in the Spirit" produced transformed Christians in the LRC? Certainly being filled with the Spirit is important. But to say that's all there is to transformation is to put oneself at a disadvantage.
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I can't say everyone is transformed. But, there are many who are transformed by the Spirit.
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Originally Posted by SavedbyGrace
In the above quote on Br. Lee's so-called 'biggest error', you give your own definition of transformation. You say 'As we become more obedient...' which implies a comparison to a state of less obedience.
How do you explain 'become more obedient'? Wasn't there a change which resulted in the 'more obedience'? What was the change?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Igzy
The change is you decide to think differently. God obviously gives us grace to do this. But you have to make up your mind to do it.
"Work out your salvation... for it is God that works in you." Phil 2:12-13
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I believe that in us dwelleth no good thing.
Rom 9:16 says So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
As per Rom 9:17,18 the Lord even sent the plagues on Egypt after God himself had hardened Pharoah's heart.
So, I do not agree that we can do anything by ourselves at all.
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Originally Posted by SavedbyGrace
You also say 'He flows more freely through us'
What medium does the Spirit take to flow though us?
'more freely' would imply some change in the medium compared to an earlier time when the Spirit was flowing 'less freely'. What is the change in the medium that enables the 'more freely' flow of the Spirit?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Igzy
The medium is our mind. The change in the medium is that we think in a way that is more according to how God would have us think. Everything hinges on that.
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I agree that we think in a way that is more according to how God would have us think? But, how?
I believe it is because God is working himself into our being? When we have more of God in our being, our mind thinks more in a way according to how God would have us think?
If you do not agree with me, how do you explain the fact that the mind thinks more as God wants us to think?