[countmeworthy]

Originally Posted by Boxjobox

Looking back at my time with the LC, I have to say I still appreciate WL's teaching on the oneness of the church, the church in the city, and the need to avoid divisions. The problem was the content he tried to fill it with.

hmm... ironically, Lee became the master of causing divisions. He had the concept down pact. It was through him and Nee the LC realized Paul in particular addressed the living saints and the church in a particular city: Corinth, Rome, Ephesus, etc... It was pointed out to us that Paul did not address Baptists, Catholics, Methodists, 'church of this or that' and that in heaven (or more importantly to him, the Holy City New Jerusalem) we will be "one" with the Father, Son, Holy Spirit and with one another in HIM.

With all the ballyhoo about "living Christ", I am amazed no one ever questioned his prayer practice, or I should really say our prayer practice. Jesus did not teach us to pray to Jesus, but to pray to our Heavenly Father.

Now hold on there! When I have been confronted with these thoughts by others, I am reminded how weird and arrogant it would have been for Jesus to tell the people to pray to Him. Think about how you would react back in the day listening to Jesus speak and He said, pray to ME!

That said, Jesus did say "I AM THE WAY. I AM THE TRUTH. I AM THE LIFE. and No one goes to the FATHER but by Me."

Furthermore. When Jesus taught His followers how to pray: "Our Father You Who are in Heaven...etc" Jesus had not yet been crucified, resurrected and Glorified. Most of those people He was speaking to were Jews as well. I don't know that the Jews of the OT ever addressed Jehovah as "Father".

Remember. Jesus came to the Jews FIRST...then the gentiles. But the Jews as a whole rejected Him. Thus the LAST (converted gentiles) shall be FIRST. We are the Bride of Christ. But Father God knows His Own and He will go after His Own, that is the Jews looking for Messiah.

It would seem to me, that if we were "living Christ", we too would have been---dare I say, imitating Jesus. Instead there was the constant "oh Lord Jesus". I feel this created a disfunctional church family.

Of course it did! It became a cliche. God wants us to have a relationship with HIM. Last night btw, I heard a testimony on Coast to coast of a man who was helping his friend fix his 18 wheeler. The 18 wheeler was up on a jack and he was under the 18 wheeler doing a last minute check when the jack gave out and the axle crushed the guy in half. Blood came spewing out of his mouth and for reasons unknown to him, He cried out 'LORD JESUS! HELP ME. LORD JESUS! HELP ME' He emphasized he spoke these words twice. It was a heart wrenching testimony hearing the grizzly details. Through the ordeal, he saw 2 angels on each side of his body. Ok... I'm getting off topic with his testimony, but to the point, this person was never an LCr and he cried out "LORD JESUS"...not Father Who art in heaven.

(That's not to say had he not said "Father God Who art in heaven", God would not have heard him and healed him.)

Instead of praying to our Heavenly Father, we would pray to our big brother, Jesus.

In the last couple of years, I have learned how and when to address Father God, the Lord Jesus Christ, our Savior, King, Redeemer, Who is Father God's WORD and His Holy Spirit, Father God's Voice. God has many titles. I am learning to use them all in my prayers and meditations.

Again. That said, remember that when Stephen was being stoned to death, he cried out 'LORD JESUS! Receive my spirit !' And Jesus stood up. He did not cry out "Father GOD! Receive my spirit!'.

We also know from the Scriptures, every knee shall bow and every tongue confess "JESUS CHRIST IS LORD". We are not going to bow and declare "Our Heavenly Father, You are LORD". Although in Truth, since the Son is in the Father and is the Mighty God, we will acknowledge Father and Spirit through Jesus Christ.

This was in spite of Jesus teaching and demonstrating that true prayer and petitions are to be to God our Father.

Back in the locality I grew up in as a believer, I recall the elders often interjected their prayers with praying to FATHER GOD...not always 'O Lord Jesus'. This was in 1975-1977.

The "oh Lord Jesus" prayers were not conducive to bringing us into a normal experience as God's children, in God's family.

It wasn't because little by little, the LC under Lee's controlling leadership moved us away from having a real genuine relationship with Father God through His Son and Word, Jesus and His Spirit of Love and Truth.

Great discussion !
Blessings!
Carol