Quote:
Originally Posted by Igzy
I think believing everyone needs to be following the same set of elders over a whole city is detrimental to receiving the believers in that city. Seems to me we have to also acknowledge that the Lord is working among them in the groups they happen to be in, perhaps in some ways better than our own, even if those groups are not organized the way we'd like.
Well, seems like this is just making the city church a sort of mini invisible, city-wide "universal" church. This is fine, I suppose, assuming you don't insist on one set of elders over the whole city.
The problem, as you can surmise from my posts, is not the idea there is one church in a city. The problem comes in when you try to organize that ostensive church with a specific set of elders and make the claim "these are the elders over the whole city." As I have said ad nauseum, how do you know that? My posts on this have probably grown tiresome to some, but that annoyance could be solved by providing an answer. No one has.
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Igzy,
I read this wonderful expressons only after I completed my previous post.
"a sort of mini invisible, city-wide "universal" church"
That's what I was trying to say. But still I have "one set of elders" over the whole city in mind.
I will explain like belows.
1. Let's suppose that there are 3 Christain groups in Mumbai
For the convenience' sake, let's dub the 3 groups as group A (100 saints), group B (200 saints), and gorup C (300 saints) except elders in that number of saints. And each group has a few elders each. So,
- group A : 5 elders + 100 saints
- group B : 4 elders + 200 saints
- group C : 3 elders + 300 saints
The total number of saints in Mumbai = 5+4+3+100+200+300=612 saints
2. How many saints in the church in Mumbai?
My answer = 612 saints = ALL SAINTS IN MUMBAI
3. How many elders in the church in Mumbai?
It depends on who is answering this question.
a. most saints in group A = 5 elders
b. most saints in group B = 4 elders
c. most saints in group C = 3 elders
d. some saints who think group A, B, C are all God's house = 12 elders (5+4+3)
Let's suppose our God recongnizes only 2 among 5 in group A, 1 among 4 in group B, and 1 among 3 in group C as qualified elders according to His heart, the answer should be 4 elders (=2+1+1). Furthermore, if there is brother Tom, who is doing the function of elder accordding to the standard of God, even though he is not offically accepted as elder in any groups, the number of elders in Mumbai should be 5 (4+1).
Now I have "one set of elders" in Mumbai, which number is 5. In most of the case, I do not know the fact there are 5 elders in Mumbai because I'm not as omniscient as God. But I know there are one set of elders who are according to God's heart regardless of my knowledge of the exact number of elders in Mumbai. And of course, "the one set of elders" are not organized according to human way.
4. Are The church in Mumbia and the elders "visible"?
God sees the church in Mumbai and elders every second.
God sees there is one church in Mumbai and 5 elders there.
I want to see as God sees.
Gubei