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Old 12-16-2016, 04:31 AM   #90
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 7,126
Default Re: Jezebel -- why we should know who she is.

Originally Posted by Drake View Post

I understand better what you saying now.

However, the governments of the world are in place according to God's ordination. The time of the Gentiles was revealed to Daniel. Not until the Lord returns will that change. Paul reiterates this when he says we need to be subject to government authorities and he also appealed to Caesar showing that he accepted that authority.

Jezebel was something different. She brought God's people into fornication and idolatry. Though it is not wrong to say that she represents the spirit and nature of the current worldly system, it is imprecise to equate her to the current government of the USA. Rather, she represents a worldliness that is related to idolatry. There really is only one entity that fits the description of Christian in name, speaking for God (she calls herself a prophetess), and ultimately aligns with but eventually is destroyed by AntiChrist. That is the Catholic Church, not the US government.

Wow, what happened to Witness Lee's sect? When I was there in the late 70s and 80s and 90s we were taught to read the Bible based on our experience. We were taught that every verse of the Bible was for us. Your doctrine basically says that all this bad stuff and judgement, that is for the Catholic church, not us.

I completely disagree. Yes, if you wanted to associate Thyatira with one "church" then sure, the Catholic church is the best fit. But my experience is that every believer must deal with Balaam and Jezebel, regardless of whether or not you are in the Catholic church. It is far too convenient and self serving to assume that part of the Bible doesn't speak to you.

The most obvious and undeniable link is 1Cor 6 -- the modern day equivalent of accusing someone of blasphemy and stoning them to death is a lawsuit for slander and libel.

Equating Paul's appeal to Caesar in a criminal case with Witness Lee's justification of a civil suit is shameful. The Apostle Paul wrote 1Cor 6. He was surely aware that he had also "appealed to Caesar".

1. Paul was already being tried, his appeal to Caesar was not the initiation of a lawsuit, but the use of the law to prevent his being assassinated.

2. Witness Lee's "appeal to Caesar" was the initiation of a civil lawsuit, Paul's appeal was a response to an attempt to bring the trial back to Jerusalem. His trial had been moved by the authorities because they had learned of a plot to kill him. Paul's point was that if there were an appeal, it should go up the chain, not down the chain.

Try as they might to justify their lawsuits, it is "utterly a fault" with the Witness Lee sect that they bring these lawsuits against others, that they are known as the group that goes around suing others, that they maintain a legal defense team. What a shame that every member in all of these churches gives to this defense fund whether they know it or not? Whatever happened to separation of the church and the ministry? It is an unholy alliance akin to Ahaz and Jezebel.

If the Catholic church is Thyatira, then Witness Lee's sect is surely Laodicea.

17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and have gotten riches, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art the wretched one and miserable and poor and blind and naked:

They claim that they alone stand for oneness while at the time acting in a shameful way condemned by the apostles.

They condemn the Catholic church for tolerating Jezebel, but look at what they tolerate.

You said: The Catholic Church cannot build the Body of Christ. Being alone cannot build the Body of Christ. The clergy laity system cannot build the Body of Christ. There is a practical church life arrangement in the New Testament that is completely congruent with the ones in Ephesians. They are symbiotic. Define that to protect the oneness. Practice that and you keep in the oneness. Deviate that and you have divisions and confusion.

You even admit they are symbiotic. We have these words given to us to define our practice, and then to keep the oneness we must practice it. You are the ones who have deviated from that and cause divisions and confusion.

2Kings 9:37 and the body of Jezebel shall be as dung upon the face of the field in the portion of Jezreel, so that they shall not say, This is Jezebel.

Dung is used as fertilizer. Jezebel became fertilizer for Jezreel, a place prophesied of by Hosea and related to Jeroboam and his sins.

But I like how Drake does not say that this is Jezebel regarding what Witness Lee did. Witness Lee's sect is like the remains of Jezebel being strewn across this bloody field. How many splits? John So and Europe. Some of the churches in Africa split. Some in South America split. The split with TC. Why is it being ripped up like this? The doctrines certainly haven't changed. No, it is the practice, the sins, the deviation from the Apostle's fellowship that has caused the division and confusion. At least one thing is sure, Drake and others who meet with the sect will not be able to claim ignorance.
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