The Orthodox Church

[InChristAlone]

Originally Posted by Ohio

My friend told me that St John wrote the liturgy centuries ago. While it may be excellent, it still is not the scripture and also limits the Spirit from speaking freshly today.

I get what you and aron are saying about endless Protestant spinoffs, but the EOC does not provide for most a suitable alternative. Sure there are dangers in these spinoffs, but the environment often facilitates fresh pursuits of the Lord Himself, returning solely to His word, which does not seem possible in the EOC.

I'm not so sure that a continuous connection back to the church fathers always is better than freshly returning to the scriptures alone. Comments?

Ohio, it is a good question. But I don't quite understand what "the Spirit speaks freshly" means. God is always the same, yesterday, and today, and tomorrow. If the Spirit speaks freshly today, does it mean that His yesterday's word is different or not fresh?

Orthodox liturgy is very sober, however, it doesn't limit the Spirit. Yes, you cannot find any kind of exaltation in the liturgical worship. But the goal of the service is not ecstasy or emotional delight or intellectual challenge but communion with God. The liturgy is preparation for communion.

Most of the liturgical service is prayer - prayer of repentance, gloryfication, and thanksgiving. At the middle of the service we hear the words of the New Testament. The pinnacle of the worship is the Holy Communion (Eucharist). The Eucharist, the Lord’s Banquet, is the center of our Christian life. It is the mystical communion of men with God, with each other, and with all men and all things in Him through Christ and the Spirit.

So, we are not looking for a fresh revelation or a modern high peak truth about God. Not only because God is always the same but also because we human beings are not able to comprehend God intellectually, with our limited understanding. Therefore, we are not looking for a new knowledge about God. We are looking for union with Him, in spirit and truth. In other words, our goal is not to know about God but to know God. And that is the goal of the Church, and of the Liturgy, and of our Christian life.

God bless.

PS About the liturgy:

https://oca.org/orthodoxy/the-orthod...divine-liturgy

http://www.stnicholastacoma.org/our-faith/liturgy

http://3saints.com/divine-liturgy.html

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by InChristAlone

Ohio, it is a good question. But I don't quite understand what "the Spirit speaks freshly" means. God is always the same, yesterday, and today, and tomorrow. If the Spirit speaks freshly today, does it mean that His yesterday's word is different or not fresh?

Not to be objectionable here, but for some people to say, "God is always the same, yesterday, and today, and tomorrow," basically means that God has become a dead idol to them, like the statue or the picture on the wall, which has not changed for centuries. That is not the relationship of a Father and a son, or a Master and a servant, that the Bible speaks of.

When I said that "the Spirit speaks freshly" to us individually or corporately in a church setting, I was referring to a score of verses like John 14.26, "The Comforter, the Holy Spirit, will teach you all things," John 16.13, "When He, the Spirit of reality, comes, He will guide you into all the reality, and whatever He hears from Me that He will speak to you."

We, as the children of the living God, do not live and worship according to dead letter or ancient liturgy, but we walk by the Spirit. That is our calling. This is how all the Patriarchs and the Apostles walked, not by structured formalities, regardless of how wonderful they were when originally ordered.

Does that make sense?

Sorry, I don't have time to peruse your links.