Should I Quit Reading LSM Publications?

[countmeworthy]

Originally Posted by Bible-believer

Yes, you should.

I agree. The more we read the scriptures, the Word of God ourselves, God the Holy Spirit will give us individually understanding of what He is saying. It is good to ask the Holy Spirit to teach us, to open our eyes to understand the Word of God.

God has also anointed good Godly teachers who also help us with understanding the scriptures. We should ask the LORD to lead us to them But we are not to put them on a pedestal and idolize them! We should also ask the Holy Spirit of Truth to lead us away from false teachings that could toss us to and fro with every wind of doctrine out there. And we don’t want to be tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine.

I once heard a teacher say “the Word of God was written FOR US all. SOME of it is written to us But not all of it is written to us”. Case in point: God required animal, sacrifices, grain, offerings, peace, offerings all kinds of offerings in the Old Testament to be taken to the priest and the High Priest. That was written to the Israelite Jews. Not to us. But it is good for us to know this.

And as We all know, Jesus is not only our Great High Priest, but He is the ultimate sacrifice for our sins.

Praise be to the Father. Praise be to the Son. Praise be to the Holy Spirit THREE in ONE

BLESSINGS Be upon all of us through Christ Jesus, our King of Glory

Carol G

[LeftLR]

You should stop reading LSM published materials and stop attending any "Local Church" or any meeting associated with Living Stream Ministry or Witness Lee's teaching. Lord's Recovery movement ONLY based on Witness Lee's writing and his speeches. Witness Lee is not a prophet, he is a regular man.

[Ex-LC-Rosemead]

You should at least learn how to check what you are getting from them, that is the Life-Study messages and other writings from LSM. I think the problem with many of us that were in the LC in the past was we did not check the doctrine we were getting from WL & LSM and confirming it with the Bible. The teachings provided by WL & LSM sounded so good and so right, because they use a lot of bible verses in their material, that we neglected to double check what they were putting out as truth and new revelations. We took it without questioning it for a long time. But once we started checking the doctrines of WL & LSM their ideas and theories began to fall apart quickly.

So the point is to check what you are getting and not take it as truth and new revelation because it sounds so good and spiritual. For example one of the doctrines put out from WL & LSM, in my time the mid 1980 was the word "zoe" refers to the divine life. But if you check this word out in the bible it means life in general, because animals, fish, plants have "zoe" too! So it can not just mean the divine life. The context in the portion your are reading will help define the meaning of what "life" it is referring to. So be-careful and double check what you are getting. Not all of the teachings are bad but some/many are misleading and you can get caught thinking WL & LSM are so rich but in reality very poor. Someone I heard said the LC is a swamp, nothing fresh coming in and nothing fresh going out.

[JorgeP]

Fraternal greetings. Paul rightly made it clear to us that we put everything to the test and hold on to what is good (1 Thes. 5:23). Thanks to the biblical teaching of exercising the spirit, (without stop my humanity, but still using it) I have been able to advance on a personal level in the discernment of spiritual things and the things of the human life. Although I hardly read the recovery materials now, when I can I want to read all the notes of the recovery version to test them and retain the good. All ministries have strengths and weaknesses, and it is necessary to learn to filter and discern. Being active in the church life in this ministry, through my personal fellowship, I was able to discern many things that were wrong, thank to abundant personal reading of the literal written Word.

Now I am investigating the ministry of the brothers of Onebody life, directed by Henry Hon and it can be seen that the good that the brothers received as a legacy of the recovery ministry, they are knowing how to combine with their new ministerial endeavor, since they are brothers who lasted many years in the recovery movement. It may help if you continue researching the recovery material to take the comments as what they are "comments" and not take them for granted as truth simply because they are in the footnote in the recovery Bible. In fact, the recovery version is a excellent translation, and I continue reading it as well as others that I read before other versions.

Now that I have a more mature multi-ministerial vision, I continue to learn to see ministerial strengths and weaknesses and I take what I consider good and what I consider bad I reject. We cannot say that everything in this ministry is bad or that everything is good. This is why it is necessary to learn to be flexible when it comes to investigating secondary topics, and regarding the main topic, we must all be clear and be radical in maintaining our common faith, which is basically that we believe that Jesus is the only true God and only Him and no one else. The rest can be debated everything else, having empathy and brotherly love with points of view and perspectives different from ours.

I think that something that took me awhile to realize after I left the movement, is that one of the main reasons (besides $$$) that they have been and continue to publish books written by Lee, because all of the books that were written before his death aren’t palatable for current generations. I know it may sound crazy, but a mere overview of the old books would have people cringe at the ineptitude, lack of serious biblical and historical support for the statements made by their MOTA. Solution for this? Rewrite, desensitize, mute, change statements, install subscription firewall to prevent most people even within the movement from getting to the roots of the teachings, beliefs and principles.

It’s a proven strategy that huge majority of people will never dig down to get to the bottom of things, especially if you keep telling them that they aren’t capable of understanding anything unless it’s provided to them by those who “know”. Just read the HWMRs, then if you feel as if you matured a bit you graduate to the Ministry Magazine, and then if you able to eat real meat, read WL directly. Took me years to get to the point where I could see all of the fakeness, all of the propping up of the empty claims, see all of the duct tape and bailing wire that they have to use to sell, make one believe their narrative. It’s when I started reading WL and WN directly, I left the movement within 6 months, and stopped reading it all. I got rid of everything that has their name on it, and it’s the best decision I’ve ever made!

[Ohio]

The writings of Née and Lee contain a multitude of riches from God’s Word, mainly because they received from others and passed them onto us. I personally believe that 19th Century England was the period of the greatest church scholarship. Many deficiencies among the Reformers were corrected and many of the challenges of the German high critiques were answered.

For example, many Recovery teachings were sourced with Robert Govett. Anyone who reads his works will realize the balanced genius in his approach to scripture. But he was not alone, numerous others in Victorian England (post-Napoleon) were called by God to search the scriptures. So all the Née/Lee teachings based on these works are very good.

But when they developed their own doctrines, the errors were introduced. This forum is filled with discussions sifting thru Née/Lee teachings to determine what is healthy and what must be discarded. To simply discard everything, as some have done, is to throw out scripture also. Error and truth are so interwoven in the Recovery that many find it impossible to discern. Comparing all Recovery teachings to scripture is a healthy, worthwhile, lifelong endeavor.

Originally Posted by Ohio

The writings of Née and Lee contain a multitude of riches from God’s Word……

Here are some riches that I heard, claiming to be directly from the Word of God.
(Paraphrasing many years of brainwashing)

- “If dogs begets dogs, and cats beget cats, it’s only make sense that God begets “gods”. That’s the extent of theological achievement in Lords recovery”.

- “We don’t know much of church history, but what we know is what Lee told us, and it’s 100% truth”

- “We don’t believe in anything about right or wrong, good or evil, we just go with the “flow” - as it pertains to our bank accounts”

- “We don’t need a men’s, women’s, marriage & family ministries, we just need to make sure that the “coworkers” and blended bros are treated well and served on every occasion”

- “We don’t hide the abuse in our movement, we just covering it in the proper way.”

- “We don’t meddle in the affairs of each locality, we just quarantine them for disobedience of the proper order”

- “We don’t offer any apologies for our actions, we just sue and demonize those who cut us red handed”

- “We built an empire on the backs of many people, while collecting six figure salaries. That’s just a cost of being Levites in this age turning generation”

- “We don’t want anyone that would ask questions, we love the people who are at peace with whatever we tell them”

- “We aren’t a cult, we paid a lot of money to have that be the thing of the past.”

- “We have deeper pockets than most groups, we even fully employ a team of lawyers to prove it.”

- “We follow orthopraxy as prescribed by our founders, because everyone else is deformed and insufficient”

- “We follow the recovered economy - in which the people are a commodity, building a community of likeminded and mingled expression. One day when we reach the peak of godhood, the tower will be completed.”

- “We don’t believe or follow any holidays, we use them as feasts. It’s an excellent opportunity to eat the best chicken without feather and bones. Unlike other Christians who haven’t seen the proper way to separate things - like Lee could.”

- “We quote Lee in every single message, article & video. Since Christianity asks WWJD, we look up on what Lee did and said.”

- “We don’t know much about grace and love, but we can offer a spot at the Grace Gardens-and you will love it! We spent millions of the church money on it, and it’s pretty exclusive honor to be there next to the founder of our movement”

- “We spent millions on the purchase of real estate around the world, - but unlike McDonalds, our processed food are highest of quality. - I’m loving it- will be the mantra in your future. Just don’t watch Super Size Me or visit LCD forum, it’s full of death!”

- “We have more websites than DT and KH combined during the election season. However, don’t worry about that. The internet is evil and death. We just there to take away ground and create proper narrative regarding our plans and visions”

- “We prefer to go after young people on campuses, women and children - it’s just kind of logical in this spiritual war!”

- “We are the only lampstand in a city, regardless if 99.9% of people within a mile radius never seen the bulb turn on even for a moment”

- “We don’t mind you coming over for a visit. But leaving your mind at home would enhance your experience, enjoyment and your emotional responses. After all, you probably can’t even know without us if what you experiencing is of the right tree!”

[JorgeP]

Originally Posted by JorgeP

Fraternal greetings. Paul rightly made it clear to us that we put everything to the test and hold on to what is good (1 Thes. 5:23). Thanks to the biblical teaching of exercising the spirit, (without stop my humanity, but still using it) I have been able to advance on a personal level in the discernment of spiritual things and the things of the human life. Although I hardly read the recovery materials now, when I can I want to read all the notes of the recovery version to test them and retain the good. All ministries have strengths and weaknesses, and it is necessary to learn to filter and discern. Being active in the church life in this ministry, through my personal fellowship, I was able to discern many things that were wrong, thank to abundant personal reading of the literal written Word.

Now I am investigating the ministry of the brothers of Onebody life, directed by Henry Hon and it can be seen that the good that the brothers received as a legacy of the recovery ministry, they are knowing how to combine with their new ministerial endeavor, since they are brothers who lasted many years in the recovery movement. It may help if you continue researching the recovery material to take the comments as what they are "comments" and not take them for granted as truth simply because they are in the footnote in the recovery Bible. In fact, the recovery version is a excellent translation, and I continue reading it as well as others that I read before other versions.

Now that I have a more mature multi-ministerial vision, I continue to learn to see ministerial strengths and weaknesses and I take what I consider good and what I consider bad I reject. We cannot say that everything in this ministry is bad or that everything is good. This is why it is necessary to learn to be flexible when it comes to investigating secondary topics, and regarding the main topic, we must all be clear and be radical in maintaining our common faith, which is basically that we believe that Jesus is the only true God and only Him and no one else. The rest can be debated everything else, having empathy and brotherly love with points of view and perspectives different from ours.

Greetings brothers, blessings, when I quoted the verse I made a mistake placing 1 Thes. 5:23 and I was referring to 1 Thes. 5:21. I want to take advantage of the opportunity to encourage you to persevere in reading, research and in the exercise of discerning things, retaining the good and discarding the bad. Although this forum is primarily about discussing the recovery movement, I believe that the gospel is intended to unite and not divide the Body of Christ.

This is why secondary topics that are not directly the person and work of Jesus can be freely debated but should not divide us, since unity is only in the person and work of Jesus. When we seek communion with other believers, let us persevere in the only communion we have in common, which is in the person and work of Jesus. One of the things that I now realize is that all ministry, preaching, service and Christian work must have as its goal unifying believers and not dividing them, even the debate of secondary issues should not have as its objective to divide us but rather to seek the truth in terms of topics that are not so clear.

How beneficial it is to allow the Lord to shape our attitude and perspective to see that the gospel really unites believers and does not divide them. Let us be more prudent when debating so that the effect is positive in persevering in unity and not encourage more division than there is.

I’m curious if Lords Recovery used racial and prejudice excuses why people refuse to follow their beliefs? I haven’t heard that before, but it must be a new low of how they defend their cultish behavior and practices. It’s in the article below.

https://shepherdingwords.com/why-we-...d-witness-lee/

It’s all about $$$$$$$$!

I found it interesting looking and reading over the LSMs mission statement on their tax filling that their purpose of existence is:

-“1 Briefly describe the organization’s mission: TO PROMOTE THE ENLIGHTENMENT AND REVELATION REGARDING THE BIBLE AS INTERPRETED BY THE TEACHINGS OF WATCHMAN NEE AND WITNESS LEE, AND TO PREPARE, SELECT AND DISTRIBUTE INFORMATION OF ALL KINDS WHICH MAY BE USEFUL FOR THE GROWTH OF SPIRITIAL LIFE AMONG CHRISTIANS.”

So much for preaching the gospel. They rather promote blind men and sell books! Over 100 million worth of them.

https://projects.propublica.org/nonp...9300223/IRS990

PS.
I wanted to see how much money did all “Lord’s Recovery” organizations, churches, non profits benefited from covid money during the past 3-4 years. If someone has that info, please post the links.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by countmeworthy

I agree. The more we read the scriptures, the Word of God ourselves, God the Holy Spirit will give us individually understanding of what He is saying. It is good to ask the Holy Spirit to teach us, to open our eyes to understand the Word of God.

God has also anointed good Godly teachers who also help us with understanding the scriptures. We should ask the LORD to lead us to them But we are not to put them on a pedestal and idolize them! We should also ask the Holy Spirit of Truth to lead us away from false teachings that could toss us to and fro with every wind of doctrine out there. And we don’t want to be tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine.

I once heard a teacher say “the Word of God was written FOR US all. SOME of it is written to us But not all of it is written to us”. Case in point: God required animal, sacrifices, grain, offerings, peace, offerings all kinds of offerings in the Old Testament to be taken to the priest and the High Priest. That was written to the Israelite Jews. Not to us. But it is good for us to know this.

This is a great saying concerning the Bible. It goes like this: The OT was written for us, and the NT was written to us.