Double Standards

[TLFisher]

Another double standard I read on a Facebook post:

"Once a story is secondhand, it begins to change, and eventually it can become a great exaggeration. This is always the case with rumors. In order to learn the lesson of long-suffering, we need to experience the suffering of restricting our mouth and stopping our tongue. We may see and hear many things, but we should not speak a word without the anointing and leading of the Holy Spirit. We must not let the enemy use our tongue for his purpose... If a brother wrongs us, we should not say a word....It is better to choose long-suffering. Then we will be saved from the wrong kind of suffering, and the church life will be kept from damage.

In order to hear one another in love, we need to fight against suspicion and fear in the church life. Instead of these two things, we should have only love. To have suspicion toward a brother means that our love is gone. Then after suspicion, fear will follow. If the two brother suspicious of each other, they will be like spies to one another. This will produce a mutual fear between them.

We must give no ground to suspicion and fear. We love our brothers; we do not fear them. First John 4:18 says, There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear."

That in bold is my emphasis. Regarding exaggerations, turmoils in the recovery were a product of exaggerations and rumors without any factchecking. Facts were neglected. Whichever rumor was the flavor of the day, that's what LSM propagated.
Of course, if you call them on rumors and exaggerations, brothers become agitated. That's the double standard.

[TLFisher]

Due to recent posts by Freedom and Abrotherinfaith, it's clear another double-standard is "the ground of the church"......"oneness based on locality"...
can't really say that when your fellowship is according to ministry publications. On one hand this is what brothers speak and respeak, but in practice there is no oneness and there is no fellowship without Living Stream Ministry.

[TLFisher]

Another double standard is handling matters in house. Specifically when discussing Steve Isitt with a NW elder (in 2009), that's what he told me. Instead of going onto the internet Steve should have handled matters in house. This is a double standard because there is no interest of handling matters in house. Steve could very well speak for himself and his numerous attempts at fellowship. There has never been a hint of impartial elders. There's been no example of capable brothers as described in Exodus 18:25-26

"He chose capable men from all Israel and made them leaders of the people, officials over thousands, hundreds, fifties and tens. They served as judges for the people at all times. The difficult cases they brought to Moses, but the simple ones they decided themselves."

So the concept of "handling matters in house" really means "cease and desist" which implies stop and do not take it up again. So, it's never really handling anything. It's as if a leading brother means to say, "we'll just sweep it under the rug".

[Freedom]

In religion there is no light, life, truth, or reality; that is, there is no Christ. Christ is there only in name, not in His person and living reality. Likewise, there is no church in reality. The church is the living Body of Christ, but what surrounds us today is a religion full of traditions, organizations, teachings, doctrines, performances, and falsehood. The Lord cannot accomplish His purpose in this situation. (CWWL, 1977, vol. 1, “The Lord's Recovery and the Present Situation of Religion,” p. 476)

Because of our standing for the pure church life, others have been offended. But what can we do? Paul says in Galatians 1:10, “If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a slave of Christ.” If we were men-pleasers, we would not suffer persecution as Paul did. The history of the Lord's recovery is a history of coming out of and being outside of the present evil age. We have burned the bridges between us and Christianity, but some among us have tried to build a bridge to bring us back. We need to burn all the bridges. There should be no bridge between the local churches and Christianity. Everything should be after its kind. The denominations are after their kind, and the local churches should be after their kind. We should be what we are without compromise or pretense. I am afraid that in the coming years, if the Lord delays His coming, some subtle ones will be used by the enemy again to try to bridge the gap between us and Christianity. We need to maintain such a gap between us and Christianity. The wider this gap is the better because it is a gap between us and the present evil age. Thank the Lord that Brother Nee was a pioneer ahead of us to come out of Christianity into the pure church life to accomplish God's will to have the Body of Christ. (CWWL, 1973-1974, vol. 1, “The History of the Church and the Local Churches,” p. 95)

In the above two excerpts WL makes some statements about religion and Christianity, regarding a condition that he perceives. He also likens Christianity to the "present evil age". On another thread, I posted a quote where WL states that standing is more important than condition. Here in-lies another double standard. WL wouldn't give any amount of consideration to the condition of the LC, and even some of those who have questioned the condition have been excommunicated. With respect to other Christians, there was no end to the criticism of their supposed condition. The condition was perceived to be so bad that WL stated that all bridges to Christianity had been burned, and 'evil' is a word that WL would use to describe Christians.

Without a doubt, LCers believe everything that WL spoke and have taken it to heart. WL's attitude towards Christians really tarnished the reputation of the LC (and that reputation isn't going away any time soon). Considering this, isn't it ironic that LC leaders would be willing to involve themselves with other Christians for the sake of improving the image of the LC? Obviously, the current process of "building a bridge" is not with the intention of genuine fellowship with other Christians, it its with the sole purpose of using other Christians as a means to create a better public perception of the LC. Behind the doors of meeting halls, criticism of Christianity abounds.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Freedom

Considering this, isn't it ironic that LC leaders would be willing to involve themselves with other Christians for the sake of improving the image of the LC?

LSM put out a book, The Experts Speak, in the aftermath of the GodMen lawsuits. One of the "experts" was a renowned vampire expert.

[UntoHim]

Just in case some of you have any doubts about Ohio's claim:

http://www.amazon.com/The-Vampire-Bo.../dp/157859281X

J. Gordon Melton was actually the lead "expert" in several of the Local Church of Witness Lee's lawsuits against Christian apologists, ministries and publishers. But just as with Hank Hanegraaff, Melton's "in depth research" was a joke, and consisted mainly of Local Church/Living Stream Ministry employees telling him what Witness Lee REALLY meant when he said things like "Judaism is satanic, Catholicism is demonic and Christianity is christless". The problem is that Witness Lee told us over and over again what he really meant, in vivid detail. If Lee was nothing else, he was very clear and even forceful about his convictions and beliefs.

The real problem with Mr. J. Gordon Melton is that he is a bought and paid for apologists for any cult that will grease his palms. If you have CASH MONEY he will step up to the plate for just about anybody.

I was already aware of this but didn't think it actually made it to a wiki page:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Gordon_Melton
"John Gordon Melton (born September 19, 1942) is an American religious scholar who was the founding director of the Institute for the Study of American Religion and is currently a research specialist in religion and New Religious Movements with the Department of Religious Studies at the University of California, Santa Barbara. He is a Distinguished Senior Fellow at Baylor University's Institute for Studies of Religion. He is an ordained minister in the United Methodist Church, and he is affiliated with the New Cult Awareness Network, an organization operated by the Church of Scientology".

For more info on New Cult Awareness Network:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Cu...reness_Network
"The 'New Cult Awareness Network' (NCAN, often referred to as simply the "Cult Awareness Network", though other than inheriting the name, it is unrelated to that older group) is an organization that provides information about cults, and is owned and operated by associates of the Church of Scientology, itself categorized in many countries as a cult. It was formed in 1996, with the name purchased from the now defunct Cult Awareness Network, an organization that provided information on groups it considered to be cults, and that strongly opposed Scientology."

Does THIS little trick sound familiar to any of you guys? Remember Jim Moran?

"Bought in bankruptcy court
Church of Scientology attorney Steven Hayes bought rights to the Cult Awareness Network assets during its bankruptcy proceedings. The old Cult Awareness Network, which publicly opposed Scientology as well as other groups it considered to be cults, was driven into bankruptcy by litigation costs in 1996. Subsequently, Church of Scientology attorney Steven Hayes appeared in bankruptcy court and won the bidding for what remained of the organization for an amount of $20,000: the name, logo, phone number, office equipment, and judgments that the organization had won but not yet collected. Initially, the Scientologists did not gain access to the CAN files, because of the threat of litigation against the bankruptcy trustee; the files were returned to the board. After Jason Scott sold his $1.875 million judgment to Scientologist Gary Beeny for $25,000, this made Beeny, represented by Scientology attorney Kendrick Moxon, CAN's largest creditor. The CAN board then settled with Beeny by turning over the files to him instead of the possibility of being individually liable for the judgement."

mmmmm, this happened in 1996, a few years before the Local Church pulled the same little stunt in buying the estate of Jim Moran, and then sanitizing the Internet of any of his research and apologetic writings. Wait a minute...you don't suppose that the Local Church brothers got this idea from their buddy J. Gordon Melton do you? .....just sayin.....

-

[Freedom]

Originally Posted by UntoHim

Just in case some of you have any doubts about Ohio's claim:

http://www.amazon.com/The-Vampire-Bo.../dp/157859281X

Thanks for this info UntoHim, I wasn't aware of any of this. It needs no saying how WL felt about things like dragons. The fact that he would allow support from a vampire expert is ironic, if not humorous. Someone having a reputation as a vampire expert would make it hard for me to take them seriously in the field of Christian apologetics.

[TLFisher]

Originally Posted by Freedom

In the above two excerpts WL makes some statements about religion and Christianity, regarding a condition that he perceives. He also likens Christianity to the "present evil age". On another thread, I posted a quote where WL states that standing is more important than condition. Here in-lies another double standard. WL wouldn't give any amount of consideration to the condition of the LC, and even some of those who have questioned the condition have been excommunicated. With respect to other Christians, there was no end to the criticism of their supposed condition. The condition was perceived to be so bad that WL stated that all bridges to Christianity had been burned, and 'evil' is a word that WL would use to describe Christians.

If the ground is so important why were so many GLA localities sued or at the minimum pro-LSM members going to form their own church/business association? I believe it was Minoru who likened these localities to leprosy- infected that needed to be torn down. In that sense he's addressing the condition of the church and ignoring the ground.

[Freedom]

Originally Posted by Terry

If the ground is so important why were so many GLA localities sued or at the minimum pro-LSM members going to form their own church/business association? I believe it was Minoru who likened these localities to leprosy- infected that needed to be torn down. In that sense he's addressing the condition of the church and ignoring the ground.

It's still mind-boggling to me how the LC could have fallen to the point where they will do something like form a business partnership in order to "take the ground" in a city. If there is a church in Toronto already in existence, then it goes against their very doctrine to form a new church in Toronto. If nothing else, the whole episode demonstrates some of the underlying problems with the ground doctrine, but the fact that they are willing to bend the rules is indicative of a large amount of hypocrisy.

[OBW]

Originally Posted by Freedom

It's still mind-boggling to me how the LC could have fallen to the point where they will do something like form a business partnership in order to "take the ground" in a city. If there is a church in Toronto already in existence, then it goes against their very doctrine to form a new church in Toronto. If nothing else, the whole episode demonstrates some of the underlying problems with the ground doctrine, but the fact that they are willing to bend the rules is indicative of a large amount of hypocrisy.

The problem is that while many of us rank a file members would not have gone where it eventually went on our own, we were duped enough to buy the excuses to ignore the Bible.

Of course, we had already ignored the Bible when we bought the whole idea of the ground.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Freedom

It's still mind-boggling to me how the LC could have fallen to the point where they will do something like form a business partnership in order to "take the ground" in a city. If there is a church in Toronto already in existence, then it goes against their very doctrine to form a new church in Toronto. If nothing else, the whole episode demonstrates some of the underlying problems with the ground doctrine, but the fact that they are willing to bend the rules is indicative of a large amount of hypocrisy.

IIRC there are something like 3 or 4 LC's in Toronto, with each on the "ground of oneness." Each "storm" brings another.