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[zeek]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

We had all of these issues in 1975, you haven't demonstrated that the economy is worse now than it was then.

By that reckoning the lot of the average American hasn't improved in 43 years. It's a perfect time for a huge tax cut for billionaires and cuts to safety net programs, Social Security and Medicare.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by zeek

By that reckoning the lot of the average American hasn't improved in 43 years. It's a perfect time for a huge tax cut for billionaires and cuts to safety net programs, Social Security and Medicare.

Social security and Medicare are examples of the "improvements" made.

Everyone agrees that Social Security in theory is better than what we had. The problem is that we are about to find out in practice if it is better.

This program put the entire countries retirement account in the hands of politicians. People that no reasonable person would allow to have access to their bank account. They have raided the cookie jar repeatedly, taking the money out and replacing it with an IOU, then taking the IOU out and replacing it with a second IOU, etc. If today the program was running great, projected to move along just fine for another 100 years then I would agree that it is a great program that needs to be protected.

But that is not the case. They are predicting that I will not be able to collect from this program even though I have been paying into it for decades. Why? Because the money was stolen. If that is the case then there is no way I agree to give them more money, only an idiot would let a thief rob them blind, and then agree to give more money to the thief.

As for tax reform I believe we have to completely overhaul our tax code so that the only tax paid is a sales tax. It is the simplest and most equitable tax. It completely avoids the concern about globalization and corporations moving their operations overseas. It would eliminate a huge bureaucracy along with all the jobs associated with tax preparation, audits, IRS, lawyers, etc. As a result it would save everyone in the country money. You could also allow certain essentials to be sold without sales tax (milk, eggs, etc) while luxury items could have a higher sales tax.

However, they won't do it. Why? It is cheaper, simpler, more equitable and more humane. Seems that Conservatives would have a lot to like, as well as libertarians, democrats, socialists, etc. No, the issue is that if you do this people will see exactly how much they are really paying in tax with every single purchase. As a result people are much more likely to become thrifty and stop buying so much junk. You would also see a black market for goods unless we could get Canada and Mexico to agree with us.

[ZNPaaneah]

Has anyone seen the ad "The Left is Unhinged"?

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Has anyone seen the ad "The Left is Unhinged"?

Sure. Why?

Don't think that ad is off base. This is perhaps the "sanitized" part of the standard diet which millennial progressives consume every day. All of those segments received much air time when they came out.

Are you in NY 14th Congressional District which just dumped Joe Crowley (potentially the next House Speaker?) and nominated Ocasio-Cortez? Crowley was an old established Liberal Democrat who was totally upset by a millennial progressive.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by Ohio

Sure. Why?

It shows that Democrats are their own worst enemy. Obviously it is not off base, it is simply a collage of quotes from the left.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Has anyone seen the ad "The Left is Unhinged"?

That's a pot kettle thing ... both left and right are unhinged ... as far as I'm concerned all on capital hill are unhinged.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by awareness

That's a pot kettle thing ... both left and right are unhinged ... as far as I'm concerned all on capital hill are unhinged.

First of all the Pot isn't even speaking, they are merely allowing the left to speak in a way that cannot be understood as anything other than unhinged.

Second, no solution will come from someone who is so cynical. If everyone on Capital hill is unhinged then what is the point of complaining about Trump?

[awareness]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

First of all the Pot isn't even speaking, they are merely allowing the left to speak in a way that cannot be understood as anything other than unhinged.

Second, no solution will come from someone who is so cynical. If everyone on Capital hill is unhinged then what is the point of complaining about Trump?

From the Beast:

Capital Gazette Survivor: I Don’t ‘Give a F*ck’ About Your Thoughts and Prayers
https://www.thedailybeast.com/capita...ts-and-prayers

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Second, no solution will come from someone who is so cynical. If everyone on Capital hill is unhinged then what is the point of complaining about Trump?

Originally Posted by awareness

Capital Gazette Survivor: I Don’t ‘Give a F*ck’ About Your Thoughts and Prayers

What? awareness cynical? God forbid!

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by awareness

That's a pot kettle thing ... both left and right are unhinged ... as far as I'm concerned all on capital hill are unhinged.

Nothing compared to Amanda Feilding running on a platform of "trepanation for the masses". So cheer up, things could be worse.

[zeek]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

Social security and Medicare are examples of the "improvements" made.

Everyone agrees that Social Security in theory is better than what we had. The problem is that we are about to find out in practice if it is better.

This program put the entire countries retirement account in the hands of politicians. People that no reasonable person would allow to have access to their bank account. They have raided the cookie jar repeatedly, taking the money out and replacing it with an IOU, then taking the IOU out and replacing it with a second IOU, etc. If today the program was running great, projected to move along just fine for another 100 years then I would agree that it is a great program that needs to be protected.

But that is not the case. They are predicting that I will not be able to collect from this program even though I have been paying into it for decades. Why? Because the money was stolen. If that is the case then there is no way I agree to give them more money, only an idiot would let a thief rob them blind, and then agree to give more money to the thief.

As for tax reform I believe we have to completely overhaul our tax code so that the only tax paid is a sales tax. It is the simplest and most equitable tax. It completely avoids the concern about globalization and corporations moving their operations overseas. It would eliminate a huge bureaucracy along with all the jobs associated with tax preparation, audits, IRS, lawyers, etc. As a result it would save everyone in the country money. You could also allow certain essentials to be sold without sales tax (milk, eggs, etc) while luxury items could have a higher sales tax.

However, they won't do it. Why? It is cheaper, simpler, more equitable and more humane. Seems that Conservatives would have a lot to like, as well as libertarians, democrats, socialists, etc. No, the issue is that if you do this people will see exactly how much they are really paying in tax with every single purchase. As a result people are much more likely to become thrifty and stop buying so much junk. You would also see a black market for goods unless we could get Canada and Mexico to agree with us.

Your chronology is screwed up. The Social Security Act was enacted in 1935, and Medicare was established in 1965 long before your economic comparison marker of 1975. Also, while you admit that there has been wage stagnation since 1975, you ignore the fact that the cost of housing , medical care and education [essential components of middle class life] has risen astronomically during that period. Meanwhile the wealth at the top has gone up exponentially during the same period. This economic disparity is a major factor driving the dissatisfaction on among the middle and working classes and the poor across the political spectrum.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by zeek

Your chronology is screwed up. The Social Security Act was enacted in 1935, and Medicare was established in 1965 long before your economic comparison marker of 1975. Also, while you admit that there has been wage stagnation since 1975, you ignore the fact that the cost of housing , medical care and education [essential components of middle class life] has risen astronomically during that period. Meanwhile the wealth at the top has gone up exponentially during the same period. This economic disparity is a major factor driving the dissatisfaction on among the middle and working classes and the poor across the political spectrum.

You were the one that mentioned Social Security and Medicare, I was responding to your post, not giving a time line.

My point is not that everything is peachy keen. My point is that there are two factors at play here, on one hand human civilization is evolving, and in a myriad of ways improving the standard of living of the majority. On the other hand human government is corrupt. The best human governments are like vultures, and the worst human governments are like dead corpses.

Science, engineering and technology are all improving at a rapid clip and as a result our GDP is continuing to grow year by year at a very healthy amount. On the other hand the US government is a dysfunctional group of crooks who have robbed the American people. The idea that giving the US government more in taxes or power is to my mind, idiotic.

No one can deny that Social Security proves the US government is not capable of being entrusted with our retirement savings. The Trillion dollar war in the middle East is proof that they are not capable of steering the US into the way of peace and prosperity. And it is part of a pattern (Vietnam war, Iran Contra, etc).

Box 13, JFK assassination, Watergate, 911 are all evidence that the US government winks at sin.

And, in my opinion, the US government is the best government. We have seen how awful German government can be. Middle Eastern govts are far, far worse than the US. Singapore is only a city, not large enough to be a fair comparison, and like all dictators once he is gone what happens then?

Perhaps Britain can compare favorably with the US but I would suggest that is only because they are so small and powerless. If you look at them when they were the empire where the sun never sets the comparison is not so favorable.

[awareness]

Originally Posted by ZNP

On the other hand the US government is a dysfunctional group of crooks who have robbed the American people. The idea that giving the US government more in taxes or power is to my mind, idiotic.

Oh! A fellow cynic.

[ZNPaaneah]

Originally Posted by awareness

Oh! A fellow cynic.

No, I do not believe that all people are motivated by self interest. What I do feel that history teaches us is that our government is a system that has promoted corruption. Teddy Roosevelt had a big impact, Lincoln did all he could, but these men of character have fought a losing battle. In the last 60 years I can point to numerous events that should have gotten them fired, trillion dollar fiascos, and yet instead of getting fired they want to raise the amount of money we send their way.

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by ZNPaaneah

No, I do not believe that all people are motivated by self interest. What I do feel that history teaches us is that our government is a system that has promoted corruption. Teddy Roosevelt had a big impact, Lincoln did all he could, but these men of character have fought a losing battle. In the last 60 years I can point to numerous events that should have gotten them fired, trillion dollar fiascos, and yet instead of getting fired they want to raise the amount of money we send their way.

Oh do you mean that "conspiracy theory" during the "Russian Reset Button" when Obama, Clinton, et. al. sold 20% of our Uranium to the Russians in return for hundreds of $Millions? Then to cover it all up they framed President Trump and appointed Muller to get him?