Lee and LC: Home Runs and Strikeouts

[Cal]

Originally Posted by aron

In a similar vein, I realised some years after leaving the LC that the phrase, "He who loses his soul-life will gain it" implies that one initially had a soul-life to lose. But in the LC, soul-lives were strongly discouraged. One instead got a ministry-issued persona. Members were never allowed to find "the real you", but were continually kept off-balance through trainings, conferences, and various "flows" from ministry HQ.

You never got a journey. You were an extension of someone else's journey.

Denying the self simply means obeying the Spirit. It doesn't mean anything else. If God approves it, it is okay; if not, it isn't. We are not supposed to walk around with a hammer, looking to pound ourselves anytime we feel good about ourselves.

I've found in experience it has more to do with my attitude and approach to a thing than whether I engage in that thing or not. For example, if I'm enjoying music, usually God will allow me to do it as long as I approach it with an attitude the Lord gives me peace about. Sometimes it's hard to describe just what that approach is, but I know it is peaceful. I think the lack of peace comes from trying to make something more of the song (or the show, or the game, or my kid's success, or whatever) than I should, and that I can really only get from God himself. As long as I put him first, he gives me much to enjoy.

It's the same with the self. It's all about our attitude toward it. It isn't that it is inherently bad. Yes, we are fallen. But that doesn't mean we are to hate what we essentially are in God's eyes. It means we can make our selves our gods just like anything else.

The LR embraces an extreme model of self-denial that denies the soul simply for the sake of doing so. It's a kind of asceticism (Col 2:23). But proper denial is always about obedience to something else that is positive, which is almost always about loving God and others first, not simply denial for denial's sake. In doing so we find our true souls, the souls we can enjoy.

We are supposed to focus on following Jesus. We are not supposed to focus on denying ourselves. God is so positive. If we truly desire to follow Jesus, denying ourselves will work itself out normally. But if you put the cart before the horse, you end up with problems, like demagogues using appeals to extreme self-denial to control you.