The Four Horses - Revelation 6

[Timotheist]

The four horses are described in Zechariah. They have been active since "the foundation of the world", which is where the first four seals were opened, and where Christ was standing 'as having been slain'.

The white horse is not the 'gospel', or anything 'positive'. Rather, the four together administer fatal judgement on mankind, with Hades in the back gathering up the dead souls.

I believe the fifth seal marks the beginning of the Tribulation. Martyrs from that point forward do not go to Hades, but rather form the army that will return with Christ soon after that.

[HERn]

Originally Posted by Timotheist

The four horses are described in Zechariah. They have been active since "the foundation of the world", which is where the first four seals were opened, and where Christ was standing 'as having been slain'.

The white horse is not the 'gospel', or anything 'positive'. Rather, the four together administer fatal judgement on mankind, with Hades in the back gathering up the dead souls.

I believe the fifth seal marks the beginning of the Tribulation. Martyrs from that point forward do not go to Hades, but rather form the army that will return with Christ soon after that.

I would like to read more about the fifth seal, can recommend some sources?

[Timotheist]

Originally Posted by HERn

I would like to read more about the fifth seal, can recommend some sources?

Unfortunately, I have yet to find a source that I like.

The first four seals are obviously linked together. The 5th and 6th seals have one thing in common: they both discuss martyrdom, and both describe martyrs as wearing white robes.

The difference, to me, is that the 5th seal refers to martyrs who were killed before the tribulation, and the 6th to those who are killed during the tribulation.

The 5th seal martyrs are in Hades, have been waiting for a long time, and are told to wait just a little longer. The 6th seal martyrs are in heaven, having bypassed Hades. I presume that when the 5th seal martyrs are given their robes, they will also be given access to heaven, to be joined shortly by the 6th seal martyrs as they are killed.

I take it that all these martyrs dressed in white will return with Christ as His army.

[Nell]

Originally Posted by HERn

I would like to read more about the fifth seal, can recommend some sources?

https://wake-up.org/book-of-life-who...ifth-seal.html

This one is interesting.

[Nell]

Originally Posted by Timotheist

The four horses are described in Zechariah. They have been active since "the foundation of the world", which is where the first four seals were opened, and where Christ was standing 'as having been slain'.

The white horse is not the 'gospel', or anything 'positive'. Rather, the four together administer fatal judgement on mankind, with Hades in the back gathering up the dead souls.

I believe the fifth seal marks the beginning of the Tribulation. Martyrs from that point forward do not go to Hades, but rather form the army that will return with Christ soon after that.

You seem pretty sure about your theory on the four horses. What is your source documentation or explanation for your position?

Nell

[Timotheist]

Originally Posted by Nell

You seem pretty sure about your theory on the four horses. What is your source documentation or explanation for your position?

Nell

Nell, a long time ago I gave up reading what others have to say. My conclusions have evolved over many years of personal research.

Of course I have been influenced by what others have said, but I do not have any favorites.

[Nell]

Originally Posted by Timotheist

Nell, a long time ago I gave up reading what others have to say. My conclusions have evolved over many years of personal research.

Of course I have been influenced by what others have said, but I do not have any favorites.

If the 4 horses have been active since the foundation of the world, how will we know when the 5th seal is opened?

Nell

[Timotheist]

Originally Posted by Nell

If the 4 horses have been active since the foundation of the world, how will we know when the 5th seal is opened?

Nell

good question.

[Nell]

White Horse - Conquering Power, gospel, Christ, Antichrist…
Red Horse - War and Bloodshed
Black Horse - Famine
Pale Horse - Pestilence and Death

All have been on the scene since the beginning times, but do these rise to the level of apocalyptic? If so, wouldn’t “things” be different? That is, the 5th seal on the verge, or clearly opened?

It appears to me that opening a prophetic seal would be more of a no-doubter, at least to many believers, that something apocalyptic was underway…

Almost every believer I’ve had discussion with believes that we are in the end times and base their belief on the current world situation and US politics and government overreach leading the way.

The main example floating around is the vaccine mandate as a precursor to people being either deceived or conditioned to voluntarily accept what could turn out to be the mark of the beast.

Please understand that I don’t know what I’m talking about. I just want to watch and pray, as we are told to do. And to “look up”. Also, clearly, we’re not in Kansas anymore.

Nell

[Ohio]

Originally Posted by Nell

White Horse - Conquering Power, gospel, Christ, Antichrist…
Red Horse - War and Bloodshed
Black Horse - Famine
Pale Horse - Pestilence and Death

Reading Rev 6.8b, which kind of summarizes all 4 horses, it says, "And authority was given to them ... to kill ..." This may indicate that the White Horse is not positive in nature, though it seems highly doubtful that it would refer to an individual called the Antichrist. Perhaps evil leaders or generals?

Many Christians, however, view the rider of the White Horse positively. It directly follows the exaltation of the Lamb of God. The rider was crowned and went forth "conquering that he might conquer."

I suppose we'll never know for sure.

Perhaps Fanny Crosby's classic hymn was influenced by or has influenced others' thoughts:

1. Conquering now and still to conquer, rideth a King in His might;
Leading the host of all the faithful into the midst of the fight;
See them with courage advancing, clad in their brilliant array,
Shouting the Name of their Leader, hear them exultingly say:

Refrain:
Not to the strong is the battle, not to the swift is the race,
Yet to the true and the faithful vict’ry is promised thro' grace.

2. Conquering now and still to conquer, who is this wonderful King?
Whence are the armies which He leadeth, while of His glory they sing?
He is our Lord and Redeemer, Savior and Monarch divine;
They are the stars that forever bright in His kingdom shall shine.

3. Conquering now and still to conquer, Jesus, Thou Ruler of all,
Thrones and their scepters all shall perish, crowns and their splendor shall fall,
Yet shall the armies Thou leadest, faithful and true to the last,
Find in Thy mansions eternal rest, when their warfare is past.

[Trapped]

Originally Posted by Nell

Almost every believer I’ve had discussion with believes that we are in the end times and base their belief on the current world situation and US politics and government overreach leading the way.

The main example floating around is the vaccine mandate as a precursor to people being either deceived or conditioned to voluntarily accept what could turn out to be the mark of the beast.

Please understand that I don’t know what I’m talking about. I just want to watch and pray, as we are told to do. And to “look up”. Also, clearly, we’re not in Kansas anymore.

Nell

In all the lead up in Revelation, I don't see anything that indicates there will be precursors or conditionings. I also do not see anything indicating those who receive the mark will be deceived into doing so, or conditioned to voluntarily accept something that turns out to be the mark (also a form of deception).

People thought social security numbers were the mark (a number, everyone has to comply), credit cards were the mark (numbers, everyone at this point needs one to function), and cell phones (numbers, follows you wherever you go, tracks your every thoughts, etc....). Now they think it's a vaccine. But that's not the mark either, or a precursor. They are fearmongering.

The way it is described in Revelation 13-14 seems like everyone will be fully aware of what is going on and makes an informed choice. You will know if you are receiving or denying the actual mark when you get it. Having the mark involves actual worship of the beast.....not "oops I didn't know what this was".

In Matthew 24, Jesus describes things that will/must happen, but regarding none of them does He say "and this is the end". He says "...but the end is still to come". I don't think we are as in the end times as people think. Beginnings of birth pangs maybe? No idea.

Also.....I too do not claim to know or be an expert. Just trying to see what the Word says about it.

Trapped